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  I'm Charlotte Mloud with investingnews.com and here today with me is Keith Weiner, founder and CEO of Monetary Metals. Thank you so much for being here. Great to have you as always. >> Hey Charlotte, how are you? >> I'm I'm doing well. How's going for you? It's our first time talking this year. >> Crazy busy. Crazy busy. >> I believe it. I know you just released your 2026 gold and silver outlook report, so we've got that to get into today. But I thought before we jump into

what's coming up, we could take a quick look back at 2025. Just get your overall review of the year, maybe look back at your predictions for last year and how they ended up panning out. So, um I I predicted about a year ago that um gold could see 3,700, I think the number was and silver could see $37, which both of which were kind of aggressive targets. And at the same time, I tried to keep it real. I I I don't want to be, you know, somebody promoting hype. So when the prices of both metals and obviously especially

silver went way past those targets I'll call that a victory because I got the direction and even approximate magnitude right and then you know silver in particular ran away. What's interesting, right, we always look at the basis uh the gold basis and the silver basis which is our measure of abundance or scarcity to the market and we're interested in how does the basis move as the price moves. So at a very mechanical level the basis is the spread. This is futures price what people call paper

gold and this is the price of the metal cash on the barrel head. Give me a bar. And there's a spread between the two which is usually positive that his future is more expensive at a you know there's a lot of theory to be said and I've written I don't know probably a million words over over a decade or more writing about this but at a very mechanical level if you see prices going up so and these these are so close together if you were to plot spot price and future price on the same graph it

would be it would look like one line like you need to zoom in like a electron microscope level of precision to really see that's a bit different but mechanically if you see the price is going up but the spread is widening which means the futures price is going up more so that means that that's where the bidding pressure is people are buying paper and that's you know because they can get 20 to1 leverage I mean buying metal is you know more expensive and more logistics and you have storage

and everything else and you don't get leverage that dealer will sell you that coin or that bar for cash whereas here they'll sell you this for 5% down or 7% down, right? So, if you see this is widening as the price is going up, that that's where the bidding is and the arbitrageers are pulling up spot to to stay close to futures but with a little bit of a lag and a little bit of I call it reluctance. So, what the normal pattern or at least the pattern you know the whole market today is still

trained it's like Pavlov's dogs. Everybody's been trained by, you know, the price action of, you know, the second half of 2011 through into 2019. And and that was every time the price would blip, you know, all the gold and silver analysts would come out with their pictures of rocket ships and the moon and the stars and all these things and it's that's it. This is the signal failure. It's really taking off now and all this. And you know, a hundred times during that period that was not true.

And um the price would blip and anybody who bought the blip would regret it because the price came right back down and made a new lower low. You know, it was a bare market for you know into 2018 certainly 2019 it wasn't I guess a bare market anymore hadn't really picked up that much yet and um and anybody who trusted the the so-called breakout and there were all kinds of technical indicators that said breakout at all these various times anybody who bought that lost. And so, you know, after, you

know, imagine if Pavlov kind of had, you know, two ways of training the dogs. Sometime, you know, like if he wanted to reward them, he'd give them the food. If he wanted to punish them, he'd whack him across the nose with a newspaper. And, you know, he rings the bell and the dog comes for the food, but he gets a a whack. You know, after eight years of that, the dog's trained. Don't come for the bell. You're just going to get smacked in the nose. And um so you know so that was a normal pattern is you'd

see a blip in the futures market and and it was it was speculators betting with leverage. Now what happened in 2025 which is very interesting. So price is going up. Okay fine and 99.999% of people are are following price and maybe you know trends which is you know price momentum and that kind of thing. But it's all price price price. But if you're looking at spread, you you notice that in 2025, particularly in silver, but to some degree in gold, you see the price rising and instead of this being

going up like this, it's this being pushed up and the spread is compressing as price is going up. And that I mean, if you want to see higher prices, that's the signal you want to see because that means people are buying metal, which means unleveraged, right? So if if you're buying futures with 20 to1 leverage that by by its very nature is a short-term flip first of all is extremely risky to be leveraged um and secondly there's a lot of cost to it. Um and so you know one way or the other

they're out of that position either because the price went up and they took their profits or the price went down and they hit their stop loss. Either way they closed the trade and so what goes up comes right back down. When people are buying metal it's unleveraged. They're taking metal, which is much more expensive to get. The bit offer spread is much wider. They're not doing that as a flip. They're taking metal and then maybe bringing it home and burying it under the floorboards, so to speak. And

so it's a much more durable uh you know, effect on the price. And so we saw that in spades in silver um to the point where now in October the price of silver was going up as I recall. And this spread actually inverted and that's called backwardation. So the price of metal in the spot market was higher than so imagine if this being pushed up being pushed up being pushed up to the point where it actually surpasses and that's what had happened. So, in October 20, uh, if you sold physical metal and you

bought a December futures contract to recover your position, you would pocket $2.15 per ounce in silver to do that trade, which is astonishing to say the least, and an indication of real scarcity. And so, post that, the price of silver continued to go up and up and up. Um, silver is backwardated uh, right now, or at least as of I haven't looked today. I don't think I looked yesterday but on Monday um as as of Monday it was backwardated and it's been in and out of backwardation since October. So real

scarcity even though price here we are at 80 something dollars that would have been hard you know to really imagine a year ago or you know two years ago when the silver price was in the 20s to say yeah we're going to have $80 silver and backquidation at that price would have been like nobody nobody would have made that call. Um, so that's what you know, you want you want the year in review. That's that's that's how I look at it. >> Yeah, that's a a great way to review

2025. And I wonder if you can talk a little bit more about this trend toward demand for the physical metal because it's something I've been hearing a lot lately in terms of entities taking delivery of physical gold and silver. In your view, why why is this happening? Why do why is it wanted? who is wanting the physical metal and do you see it continuing in 2026? >> You know, I I guess one thing to clarify, I I don't think that it's the same people who used to buy paper now

want physical delivery. I think the people who are demanding physical delivery are different players than the, you know, so the the people that are buying paper, people are buying futures are less present. Now, in the run-ups in January, um the the the paper buyers and the leverage, uh you know, particularly in silver, it got to a pretty extreme level. And so that's why I mean, you know, here I am in Dubai. Uh you know, one person here was describing the price chart of silver like the Burj Khalifa.

That's that crazy spire that's 154 stories tall. Now, a lot of people may not realize this. The base of the Burj Khalifa has these pretty big buttresses. It kind of makes sense. It's a very tall building and it's like 800 mters or something. So, you know, it's a lot of wind force and whatever. So, you want a really wide base so it doesn't, you know, tip over in the wind or I don't know if they get earthquakes or whatever. But anyway, so the price of silver kind of looked like the bridge

khalifa. And as the bridge khalifa goes up, it keeps actually stepping back. So, it's not perfectly vertical even all the way up almost to the very top. And so, someone said, "Oh, the price of the silver chart looks like the bridge khalifa." It's like, yikes. that that can't be good. And in the weeks leading up to that, my feeling was I don't know when, but um you know, with a with a a rise as vertical as this, you know, and then when I'd run into, you know, bullion traders at banks and things like

that, oh yeah, you know, we're telling our clients to position, get out of this because this is going to have to. So anyway, so leverage blew out. But um you know what's what's happened in silver, I think, right? So you have the solar play, you know, silver is used for solar panels. A lot of these stories be, you know, become stale and by the time they're circulating through the investor community, the story is either more than fully priced in or maybe even not entirely true anymore. And so, um,

what's what's going on when silver's $20, then, you know, manufacturers of things like solar plant and panels just aren't that worried about it. But when silver like quadruples to $80, if there's one thing you can bet, it's that every um you know, whether it's the factory manager or the CFO or the CEO, the summit in the team of engineers, every solar panel company, every antimicrobial countertop company, every like anti- odor gym sock company, you know, because they all put a little

silver in there, which which kills the bacteria and that's great. or obviously in solar panels, you know, washing machines, they have relays so they can turn on and off the various motors. Those relays have silverplated contacts. And the makers of all these things at $20, you know, maybe fairly chill about how much silver is being used, but at $80 or $120, you you could you can bet your bottom dollar. They're calling the engineers in and they're like, "Please work on you optimizing this product to use less

silver." And uh so economists have a term for this. This is called thrifting. Um you know reduce the you know the thing. So as everyone thinks oh yeah you know industry is consuming all the silver just as that story is really you know bubbling to the surface is when industry is actually working on you know consuming a lot less uh because because there's a financial incentive you know to do so. So um but what I think is happening is you know the silver market is a much smaller market than gold. It

doesn't take nearly as much buying pressure to drive the price up and it doesn't take nearly as much selling pressure to drive the price down as as it would in gold. And um with the price of gold being where it is, remember gold has outpaced wages everywhere. So whatever whatever your wage could afford in terms of ounces of gold two years ago, you can't afford that number of ounces today as as the same, you know, percentage of your weekly wage or your savings or whatever. And um in India you

know that's doubly so. So India is a country 1.4 billion people and 100% of them are screaming mad for gold. um you can't I just had an interview earlier today with a reporter in India and she was as astonished I think as as you know as your audience presumably Canadians and uh US people would be when I said you know look in the west and in the US less than 1% of investors would have any gold I mean her eyes widened she's like oh my god really she can't imagine that and here if I say look 100%

of the Indians have gold the audience here is going to be like what really like that how Could that be so two worlds apart and that it's not even remotely similar? So 1.4 billion people average per capita GDP across India $3,000 a year. So they're all screaming mad for gold, but they don't make most of them don't. I mean, there's there's a increasing, you know, wealthy and affluent class that make a lot more money and almost, you know, western levels, but um, you know, most of them

don't make anywhere near that that money, but they all want to put as much as they possibly can into gold. So, you'll get some untouchable cast guy, you know, literally cleaning poop out of the streets for $2 a day, which is the minimum wage. Um, and he will save up for months or years or whatever and he'll buy some tiny little fleck of a grain of gold and he'll be really really proud of that and he'll be working to get a second fleck to add to his you know collection. So now price of gold's

gone up a lot. Um, the preferred uh or I should say a preferred method of buying gold in India is jewelry. Now, western analysts talk about jewelry demand versus, you know, savings or or or money demand or whatever you want to call it. They're the same in India. The jewelry is sold by weight, you know. So, you're buying a necklace and that necklace could be five grams. I picked up one in a jewelry store here in Dubai. 89 grams, almost three ounces. I I pity anybody who has to wear it because at

the end of the day, you're going to have a a welt on the back of your neck. I mean, it was really heavy. So it's it's sold by weight and then there's a making charge they call it which is the you know fabrication cost which is you know do you buy very often singledigit percentage points. So people are buying jewelry here at the same premiums that normally people would pay for a maple or an eagle. Um but that's that's how they buy gold and there's usually a little screen in the store somewhere that shows

what the current gold price is and you know you're going to pay that plus whatever 5% for the for the making charge for the necklace. It it is investment demand pure and simple. Now as the price goes up, people have to buy less gold. And so you know first you make you know you make it hollow. So you know it would used to have this big h you know excuse me solid chunky links in the necklace. Then you make them hollow and then you make it thinner and thinner and then you make it kind of a lace work

thing where it's you know hollow. Not only hollow but you can see light through it because they removing all this gold here and there. at some point you can't make it any lighter and um so what are they doing? A lot of them are switching to silver. So takes a little bit of buying pressure off gold and which doesn't necessarily affect the gold market all that much but it adds a little bit of or maybe not a little bit of buying pressure to silver which affects the silver market quite a

lot. And so you get Indians buying silver for jewelry, which isn't now they love silver, uh, but not as much as they love gold. And if they can get gold, they'll get the gold. If they can't get gold, cuz you know, it's 50 at that time, you know, $5,500 an ounce. Now $5,000 an ounce. If you can't get gold, then you get silver is the next best thing. And so, um, I think that's a big part of, you know, what happened. So in your view with these dynamics dynamics going on, you mentioned we've

got the industrial users of silver going toward thrifting. Meanwhile, gold is expensive. So in the east they're looking to buy more silver jewelry. Is silver going in a more monetary metal direction with all this going on? >> Yeah, absolutely. If you look at um you know, as it so happens, I have a uh somewhat antique um I don't know if it's a te it's a coffee pot, I guess, but it's solid sterling and there's a a creamer and a sugar bowl and you know, little lids and it's all sterling. And

you know, if you call around, there's absolutely no bid on that stuff as table wear or even as antique, you know, curios. The bid is melt. So that's the market saying we want it in monetary form. We want it in bullion either coin you casted into gold silver eagles or maple u uh maple leaf silver maples or uh bars. So the the market is saying we don't want all this antiquities and numismatics and um you know table wear whether it be forks, knives, you know spoons, silver platters, teapotss. We don't want that

stuff. We just want bullion. And so if you know, most people believe in the quantity theory of money. So the scarcer something is the higher price should be. And so the silver community in particular spent 30 years trying to argue that there's dwindling quantities of silver around as as an attempt to to it's like goal- directed reasoning. It's not really the right way to think about any topic. If you find yourself having a conclusion in mind and you're trying to find logic to steer its way to your

conclusion, you should stop and say, "What am I doing here?" But um you know the idea is okay there's dwindling quantity of silver and by the quantity theory of money you know the silver price should be higher. But if the argument is that industry is consuming all the silver stocks, that argument is that silver is being demonetized and if silver is being demonetized, it just becomes an expensive industrial ingredient. No different from platinum, palladium, rodium, etc. Maybe a lower

price obviously than platinum or palladium, but um it's just an industrial ingredient. And maybe there was a certain amount of consumption of stocks during, you know, a period of time and now what you're seeing is it being remonetized with a vengeance and everything that isn't in in monetary silver form being melted to, you know, you know, you talk to dealers and they're talking about melting so-called junk silver. So these are the silver coins pre-1965. And you know, for a long long time,

people would just buy bags of that stuff by face value. this is a $500 bag, $750,000 bag, whatever of it. Um, that's all being melted to to be turned into silver bars again. And um, you know, again, the market wants it in pure bullion form, not any of the rest of this, you know, stuff. So, I'd say that's the silver is being remonetized or it's reasserting its monetary authority, um, you know, one way or the other, which this is how it always was. I mean throughout, you know, thousands of years

of human history, you know, working people didn't really get their hands on gold. Um, you know, maybe occasionally or they'd see a glimpse of it or whatever, but you know, the the old saying was, you know, gold is the money of kings, silver is the merch as the money of merchants. Uh, you know, copper, brass, bronze was the was the wages of the peasantry. Um, and um, you know, that was always historically true. And so now suddenly gold to $5,000 once again is kind of out of reach. Now you know if

you're in the US or Canada and you want to you certainly can buy some ounces of gold, but that that those few gold coins you get are not going to be nearly as satisfactory a handful as you know versus silver. If you put $1,000 into gold, it's a fifth of an ounce less than that because there's a much bigger premium on that small. You want to buy $1,000 worth of of silver at today's price? It's like 12, you know, silver eagles that has a handful. Has a lot of half. It's it's emotionally satisfying.

Um and and and the 1 oz coin is the standard unit. You know, if you want to buy a fifth of an ounce of of gold or you buy two one10en ounce, you know, eagles, not really a standard thing. And the premium you're going to spend is hundreds of dollars an ounce. It could be a 10%, you know, 10 or 12% premium on it. It's just not a very efficient, you know, if that's savings, it's not a very efficient way to do it. >> Yeah, I definitely see what you're saying there. And talking a little bit

more about the remonetization of silver, I think another point that's been getting a lot of attention is the premium in China for silver. So, is that all part of the same story or or how are you seeing that fit in? >> You know, um, yes, ultimately. I mean the stuff is all global you know one way or the other and and each participant in a market whether they be in the Netherlands whether they be in Vancouver whether they be in Phoenix or they be in Dubai has a piece of the picture they have some

information it's like one puzzle piece and the the tapestry is much bigger right and it's all of a piece and and the piece is that the regime of irredeemable currency is failing now some people think okay the dollar is going to fail first. That's that's definitely wrong. That's not an opinion. That is absolutely, you know, the dollar will fail last and all the other things are failing. But in the rest of the world, they they certainly have a uh a lovehate relationship with the dollar. On the one

hand, they crave it um because it is the currency of of greatest utility by far. And you know, everybody finances the major things in dollars. And so if you i f you have if you're loaded up to your eyeballs in dollar denominated debt, you need dollar denominated revenues or else. So so they crave it. They love it. They need it. And you know, if you're in China, you certainly don't want Indian rupees or Russian rubles or any of these other things, you know, Korean one, you know, whatever. Those those currencies

are are not useful outside their countries as dollars. On the other hand, they have reason to hate, you know, if not necessarily America. Now, the Chinese government, we'll see what direction it's going in. Um, and I don't I don't really want to get out of my swim lane and talk about that part of geopolitics, but you know, clearly things are a bit chilly between President Xi and President Trump at the moment. Um but you know leaving that aside um there's there's increasing

uh you know views globally to to look for an alternative to the dollar. Um even if it's just like every every business beyond a certain size wants two vendors for each thing. You don't want to be captive to just one vendor um you know two suppliers or whatever. So, you know, what can we use just to reduce our risk that we're exposed to one thing? And um what they all want is another paper currency that would work, but that's not what they're going to get. There is no other paper currency that

comes remotely close. And I'm talking about, you know, orders of magnitude difference between the dollar and the next the next, you know, biggest currency, which would be the euro. Orders of magnitude different. I mean, it's not even not even night and day. They're not even the same planet. And um so the one thing that that would work or that will work is gold. And um that's the one thing that ain't nobody want that. You know, all the central bankers around the world, they all go to the

same universities. You know, it's Oxford and Cambridge and Harvard and you know and so on. Um Berkeley, University of Chicago, right? and they all get the same training, which is some blend of Keynesianism and monitoism and neocclassicism. It's all the same rubbish. Um, and so, you know, I've been I've been using this uh quote from Winston Churchill. He gave this real backhanded compliment to uh to the US and he said, "God bless America because after they've tried everything else,

Americans will do the right thing." It's like, okay. Yeah. Thanks, Winston. I appreciate that. um you know, God bless the world after they tried everything else, they're going to they're going to go to gold. And um so, you know, you're starting to see gold uh in very very early edges. I mean, there's not a lot of this going on at the moment, but I think the trend is is inevitable. Uh you know, using gold to settle uh because if you're not going to use the dollar to settle trade, it's

got to be gold. There's nothing else that's going to going to work. So um you know that being said that makes gold very interesting you know for a number of reasons. Meanwhile on Twitter or X you know the Bitcoiners are like gold isn't being used as a means of exchange. Gold isn't being used for anything. They resent that you know we say that I got bitcoin. And um I uh I had a tour of a jewelry wholesaler here in Dubai uh you know last fall. And um you know after it was a meeting really but after the

meeting they gave me a little tour of their place and you know it's one one room it's like oh yeah this is where the retail jewelers you know count the jewelry and weigh it and test it and whatever and you know it's where they pay us. Okay great. And they had this giant bolt cutters leaning in the corner this massive thing. And I mean just like the business end of it was like this big. And this thing must have been 20 kilos. I mean, I picked it up and was like, I could really feel the weight of

this thing. I was like, you guys must have some serious high security locks that you must cut with this. Oh, no. We use that to cut gold bars. I was like, what? Oh, yeah. You know, when uh the jewelers pay us for the jewelry, they pay in kilo bars. And um you know, if they owe us 3.7 kilo bars, they take out four kilo bars and we cut.3 of a kilo bar off. And that gives them back to them as change. So I said, 'Well, you've just made me wrong on something because I've been writing for years that the problem with

the bigger bars is you, it's hard. You can't make change. I mean, gold is really soft. You could carve it with your with your pocket knife, but you destroy the bar. You destroy the integrity of it. Nobody's going to trust it anymore. And here these guys are like taking a big laugher and cutting the bar off. And which, you know, logically makes sense, right? But just to see it and they're just so you know in the west we just sit here and debate all these things like it's some abstract academic

theory and then you go to a place like this and the Indians and Arabs and the Turks they're just doing it. They're not talking about it. They're not writing about it. I mean, imagine like 10,000 years from now, assuming there's still human civilization, archaeologists will be unearthing like a McDonald's and there's going to be like PhD dissertations written about what the meaning of the antichamber to the, you know, like the front lobby where you order and you go up to the counter, what

the meaning of this was and what religious rights occurred in this space, you know, because they're not going to really understand it. And even if they had access to um contemporary American, you know, let's say non-fiction writing about the culture, anthropologist or whatever they're saying, no one really talks about like a drive-in or drive-thru window at McDonald's. Like that's not the subject of nobody talks about it. Just is what it is, right? I mean, if you're in Canada, in the US,

maybe it's more like Tim Hortons in Canada, but you know, if if you live here, you just take it for granted. You don't talk about it. And that's that's how it is. They're just using it as, you know, for them that's normal. And and if their government were buying, you know, oil or or corn or soy, um, you know, paying in gold, in India, they wouldn't bat an eye. In Turkey, they wouldn't bat an eye. In the Arab world, they probably wouldn't bat an eye. U, the Chinese and

the Russians would understand it because, okay, you're avoiding the dollar. Yeah, it' be a little bit unusual. It would be innovation for them, but um you're avoiding the dollar. Okay. They would nod. They would understand. And Americans would be like, "Wait, what? No, they can't be. Nobody would be using gold." Well, yeah, they are. They are. >> Yeah, that's a great anecdote. Thank you for sharing that. And just to go back to the outlook report for 2026, I noticed

it says right on the cover, the era of monetary competition has begun. So it sounds like that's the direction that you're going in with what you've just been talking about. But anything further you would add there because I think that's an interesting statement. >> So you know there's two angles to look at this from. There's the within the paper world who's winning and who's losing. And unfortunately for a lot of people dollar winning a lot of marginal currencies losing. And I think the big

big story I mean some people are talking about I'm not the one to originate the story by any means. Uh but it's not a mainstream story yet is how you know US dollar stable coins like Tether give access right if so if you are the unhappy subject of some uh you know marginal country with a horrible inflation problem capitals you know you can't get dollars and you know these places you that's what you would want. you don't want to see your savings go up and smoke, but you know they they

control you and you know it's kind of a semi athoritarian dictatorship whatever. Now with uh you know tether and other stable coins, you have access to dollars and um the people are going to choose dollars while the regimes you know nash their teeth and and you know pull their hair out. And so I think that there's going to be a massive you know increase in dollarization around the world because the people will vote with their own wallets. And so I think there'll be a massive influx into the dollar and the

other currencies will fall against the dollar and some of them will fail entirely. Um others will just go down, you know, even faster than they are. And um you know, Americans are like, "Yeah, we're America. It's just cuz we're back." It's like, no, there's there's there's a more nuance story here than that. And um you know, as uh what did what did Gandalf say in Lord of the Rings? um things have been done that cannot be undone and you know now something's in in uh in motion that

cannot be stopped and um you know that's that dynamic. So within the paper world, the dollar is winning and and will continue to win. But the entire paper world is going to lose ground gold because the paper world is designed to screw the savers and screw the investors. And as long as they have it under control, that you know screwage, if I can coin that term, isn't that great in magnitude, people will put up with it. But we're we're entering into a point now where um more and more people

don't want to put up with it and then they they turn to they turn to you know primarily gold but to some degree silver and um you you know so thus you know is gold in a bull market. Yes. But then I would turn around and say it's only because we're measuring in dollars. You look at it objectively the lighthouse isn't going up. It's the ship that's sinking. So we're on the dollar ship saying the lighthouse is going up. Is the lighthouse in a bull market? Well, yes, but to be technical about it, it's

the ship that's in a bare market. And so, you know, uh, in January 28, the dollar ship hit under 6 milligrams of gold. And, um, you know, will it go lower than that? Yeah, it will. How much lower? You know, for this year, you know, get the report and see my, you know, price call on that. We'll see how that turns out. But um yeah, we're we're we're con continuing to be in that market environment. >> Just a a quick note on Tether. So they're a US dollar stable coin issuer,

but they've also become a huge gold buyer. So how are you seeing that play out? What do you make of that? >> Very interesting, isn't it, that even the big crypto players have a need for gold? And um you know I I don't want to do a victory dance and glute and spike the football and all that too much but um I think you know the people in the crypto world when they make big money they don't want to put it in fiat but they don't necessarily want to keep 100% of it all in in crypto because they all

know that crypto can be very volatile and and the bare markets even even if things eventually cover the bare markets can be wicked. So, if you don't if you want to take some money out of crypto and you don't want to put it in dollars, where are you going to put it? And it's a heavy metal beginning in G and ending in D. And um so yeah, they uh they reportedly have was it 80 tons or something. That's quite a lot of gold for a private uh you know, party to have. Um and uh you know, we'll see what

they do with it. >> Yeah, we'll have to see how that plays out. And so you mentioned you've got the gold and silver price calls for 2026 in the report. We'll have a link in the video description so everybody could take a look and read it. But would you mind sharing what you see given everything that you are looking at coming in 2026? Where do you see the prices going >> with, you know, with some jitter along the way? It's it's not a straight line. It's certainly not a vertical line like

January and silver. >> Yeah. Yeah. So, we're going up and maybe you could just talk a little bit more about how we can see those price corrections even when we're in an uptrend because this move downward that we saw toward the end of January into February. I know a lot of people saw it as a buying opportunity and they were quite pleased with that. But there's also a lot of discussion among people who wondered is this the end for gold and silver? What's really happening? So,

how how do you see that? How do you see those ups and downs progressing? Is that just something we have to be prepared for? Yeah, I mean, you know, if the price is going to move very far, there's going to be corrections along the way. Markets do not move in straight lines. And um, you know, there's a self similarity, right? So, if you look at the 5-second chart or if you look at the fiveday chart, you look at the five month, you know, they all have sort of a degree of roughness to them, which means, you know, ziggs

and zags, it's not all it's not all smooth curve in one direction. And, um, you know, there's a million reasons for that. One is, you know, I have a lot of beefs with macroeconomics, but one of which is, you know, the attempt to use equations to describe essentially human behavior. And there's two problems with that. One is, you know, people are not like particles of an ideal gas. People have pesky things like reason and free will and stuff. But the other is that there's a finite there's an integer

quantity of people doing an an integer quantity or discreet quantity of transactions. So using differential equations just isn't even right to describe you know what's going on. And so because things are discreet because future contracts futures contracts have a finite expiration date and so there's a discontinuity when you know so that's this is in the process happening right now with the February gold contract. We've got another, you know, 101 15 days. I don't know when when uh last

delivery, you know, day is for February and then it goes off the board entirely. And, you know, by now most people would be rolled over into April anyway. Everything's discreet, which means you have edges. And you know, if you study physics, if you study engineering, when you have edges, you get discontinuities, you get inflection points, you get things that are very funky and don't really nice math equations to describe them. And that's part of it. And part of it is if people see a chart of a price

that only wants to move in one direction, it becomes perceived to be safe to go in with a lot of leverage. Right? So this thing is going it's a it's a guaranteed trade. Can't possibly lose. Right? You I'm saying all these things, you know, not just facitiously, but I guess that's the mentality that develops. So people come in with all this leverage. Now, the problem is, you know, leverage allows you to drive the price a lot farther. If you're on 20 to1 leverage, you can push the price 20

times harder than if you could if you came in cash market. And then if you have more and more people piling onto that trade, you'll push the the price even if the trend is supposed to be going like this, you push it more than that. And um you know then because of the nature of leverage, the moment you have a down tick, somebody hits a stop stop-loss order and that causes another down tick and that triggers someone else's and you get a cascade all the way down until you flushed leverage. And so um that's just

you know how markets are structured. Um, and you know, everybody who's everybody who's trading, most people who are trading are using leverage because it enhances returns. You know, just better deal with that. And the stackers should, you know, you can't get killed if you're stacking metal, right? I mean, you bought the metal, you paid 5,600 for gold, whatever. Okay, you're not happy that gold went to 4600 or 4,800, whatever it was, but it's not going to take the food off your table. You put

you put savings into it that you don't need right now. Okay, fine. Put that metal aside and look back. You know, I bought a lot of my metal back in late 2008, early 2009. And initially, you know, there were little dips and whatever that damn it, I missed it. I wanted the I wanted to buy $20 sheep or whatever it was at the time. you know, that price is looking very quaint today. It was it was, you know, between $900 and $1,000. Um, and um, you know, that's what's going to happen, you know, over time. I

mean, we're in a dollar bare market for reasons. And so, but yeah, people better be prepared for the volatility because as things go off the rails, which is what's happening to the dollar, yeah, there's volatility and there's days when people can't sell the dollar enough and there's days when they're desperately, urgently trying to grab as many fistfuls of dollars as they can and the dollar is extremely well bit and you'll see that as the price of gold falling. So, um,

you're going to get it. You're going to get it both ways, but the trend is is clear and and the drivers are clear. >> Well, I think that's a great place to wrap up unless you had anything else on your mind that you would want to leave investors with right now. >> Um, if you don't have any gold, you should buy some. And it's not a function of price. It's a function of just have a little bit. um just because um start to think about where this monetary system is going. If you're

trading gold, be careful and I always advise against you know using too much leverage. Um there's a guy, he may be watching this, in which case, hey, I apologize buddy, but there's a guy that I know that was trading silver and um had quite a large position, long position in silver futures. It got to the point where he told me he wasn't sleeping at night and you know, he's pulling his hair out and just feeling horrible about it. And I think that's one of those things like how much how

big a position is too big? Well, if it's interrupting if it's interfering with your ability to sleep, it's too big. back off. Don't use so much leverage. Don't have such a big position. Um, you know, it's not worth it. This this can be a brutal two-way market. Obviously, look at the monetary medals indicators. If you go to our site at the bottom, you know, it's data science, you know, I think it's the category. Click on that, you see all the charts, follow the gold basis, you'll be better

informed than 99.9% of the uh rest of the traders out there. And um you know be careful. This this is dangerous dangerous times in a dangerous market and you do not want to get flushed out and lose your capital. >> Great advice to end on. And of course we'll have the links for you in the video description so people can check them out. And next time I'll bring you a quote from Lord of the Rings cuz I just started listening to the audio book. So I will have one for you next time. But

thank you so much for coming on to talk. >> Thanks. Look forward to it. >> Of course. And once again, I'm Charlotte Mloud with investingnews.com and this is Keith Weer of Monetary Metals. Thank you for watching. If you like this video, make sure you hit the like button and sub scribe to our channel. We'd also love to hear your thoughts, so leave us a comment below.